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Thread: Schoenfeld, Leger, Sather, and Risebrough Attend Montreal vs Ottawa Game

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    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    I don't get you guys. Do you not understand that Mario Tremblay said on radio a few days ago that Galchenyuk had "twice sought help for substance abuse problems". Likely opioids. It sounded like something he was dealing with last year and this summer. A known Montreal beat reporter said that they've tried to trade him at a discount. Said he had a partyier rep. No takers. Both his coaches say he refuses to play defense and isn't a true center. His effort has been questioned multiple times.

    And you guys would consider trading Kreids for him. Why? Even if they throw in a pick. Geez, if we are gonna trade Kreids, let's not make it for guys teams are trying to dump. Galy is too risky. If Gorton does this I'll lose my shit. Take a flier on Galy with a prospect and conditional draft pick. That's my limit.

    For Kreids how about RNH and Nurse. Or if it is Ottawa, how about for Mark Stone (my UFA pick who'd have to agrees to a new 6 year 6 mil contract with us) to be our 1RW of the future. Or Josh Manson and a top forward prospect. Point is, Kreids should be a piece used when we can get prized value in return. If his value is not high enough now, then wait until it is. He should get hot eventually.
    Yes, I would consider trading Kreider for a potential lottery pick and a 23 year old 30 goal scorer who could desperately use a change of scenery. Ask for Poehling too if Kreider is so valuable and Galchenyuk is so worthless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    Yes, I would consider trading Kreider for a potential lottery pick and a 23 year old 30 goal scorer who could desperately use a change of scenery. Ask for Poehling too if Kreider is so valuable and Galchenyuk is so worthless.
    OK, upon thinking about it further, if you are already of the mind to tear it down, then a gamble that Montreal gets a top 10 pick isn't a bad strategy. Especially, if we get to gamble on Poehling, who I don't see as a super skilled guy, more of a 3C type with size and ability to get in front of the net. I'd love to snare Byron, if we need a bottom 6 winger because we trade a winger.

    Here's the problem. The Habs are not trading their 2018 #1 until they are a playoff team. It is potentially too valuable and we are not scouting their picks. And could you imagine them sending us their 2017 #1 pick (Poehling) and 2018? The city would go Franco. They want to dump their trash and find a young Dman and some scoring. We can't be their trash collector and I'd rather send Kreids out of conference unless a deal is too sweet to pass up.

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    Galchenyuk has way to many issues to invest in him right now. Having off ice problems make him a complete nonstarter for me. He's not good enough to carry that baggage and contract. If kreider is going how about turris on Ottawa as the base for a trade? No thanks on rnh in Edmonton. talk about soft. I don t think the guy can bench 75 lbs. I'm in no hurry to trade kreider in fact I'd rather move zucc. But if I'm trading either I'm not rushing into it to try and salvage this year. I will not get ripped off in the deal. They both have value and both carry fair contracts.

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    I don't trade Kreider for Galy. No chance. Vesey maybe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    OK, upon thinking about it further, if you are already of the mind to tear it down, then a gamble that Montreal gets a top 10 pick isn't a bad strategy. Especially, if we get to gamble on Poehling, who I don't see as a super skilled guy, more of a 3C type with size and ability to get in front of the net. I'd love to snare Byron, if we need a bottom 6 winger because we trade a winger.

    Here's the problem. The Habs are not trading their 2018 #1 until they are a playoff team. It is potentially too valuable and we are not scouting their picks. And could you imagine them sending us their 2017 #1 pick (Poehling) and 2018? The city would go Franco. They want to dump their trash and find a young Dman and some scoring. We can't be their trash collector and I'd rather send Kreids out of conference unless a deal is too sweet to pass up.
    Well if Kreider is getting traded I'm tearing it down. There are a shit load of if's but this is all wild speculation anyway.

    In my perfect world, 3 years from now, we have Zib 27 - Chyitl 21 - Andersson 21 down the middle, Miller 27 - Vesey 27 - Buch 25 on the wings, Skjei 26 on D, Igor 24 in net. Now add to that young core a 26 year old now mature Galchenyuk, our own high 1st rounder in 2018, a high 1st rounder from MTL in 2018, and mid to late 2018 1st rounder from trading Nash at the deadline. Add another first of our own in 2019. Maybe one more for trading Zucc. What could you add to it if you traded McD? If you're going Zib, Chyitl, Andersson down the middle there's no room for Hayes, what can he bring back?

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    The Rangers dispatched president Glen Sather, assistant general manager Jim Schoenfeld and pro scout Gilles Leger to Ottawa on Monday to check out the Canadiens-Senators match.

    Alex Galchenyuk, Montreal’s 23-year-old natural center with top-six potential who was on the fourth line against the Senators just as he was against the Rangers on Saturday, could have been a person of interest to the front-office triumvirate.

    But the Blueshirts also like Montreal’s Andrew Shaw, the abrasive 26-year-old forward who can play both center and wing and who plays an edgy, abrasive game unlike anyone currently on the New York roster.
    http://nypost.com/2017/10/31/rangers...scouting-trip/

    I actually mentioned Shaw, by name, in my last C4C article. The five-year term sucks, but that's what retention is for. If MTL is willing to eat at least 25%, he'd be in at around $2.9M.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    Galchenyuk has way to many issues to invest in him right now. Having off ice problems make him a complete nonstarter for me. He's not good enough to carry that baggage and contract.
    Well said, fatcesa.

    If kreider is going how about turris on Ottawa as the base for a trade?
    I like Turris, but he's a UFA at the end of the year. Rumor is he is on the trade block, even though the public stance is they are making good progress in contract talks. He wants 7-8 years and he is already 28. Currently making 4 Mil (3.5 cap hit) and will expect to get at least 5.5 per since he's a 55 point C. Seems too rich for a guy who will start contract at 29 and gets over 60% Ozone starts.

    Anything more than 5 years is dangerous. Even if he had Kreids current term, I'd be reluctant to make the trade.

    No thanks on rnh in Edmonton. talk about soft. I don t think the guy can bench 75 lbs.
    Well I had Nurse accompanying him (he's got thump) and we send Holden the other way. And RNH brings all the speed Turris does, but plays much better D. Much younger, more upside and more managable contract term. [/QUOTE]

    I'm in no hurry to trade kreider in fact I'd rather move zucc. But if I'm trading either I'm not rushing into it to try and salvage this year. I will not get ripped off in the deal. They both have value and both carry fair contracts.
    Absolutely! Sounds like good strategy and solid asset mgmt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    http://nypost.com/2017/10/31/rangers...scouting-trip/

    I actually mentioned Shaw, by name, in my last C4C article. The five-year term sucks, but that's what retention is for. If MTL is willing to eat at least 25%, he'd be in at around $2.9M.
    You named him Phil, but Dude suggested Shaw in the forum first. You get a nod, but give a Dude his due.

    OK, like we discussed on the other thread, what's fair for Shaw? Kreids is a big overpay and they are not going to throw in their 2018 #1. Even if they throw in Byron and a #2, I probably don't do it. Shaw and Galy? I think I'd understand it and hate it.

    They want D. DeAngelo would be the closest value, but they'd probably want Fast or Nieves added. And do we really want to give up DeAngelo.

    OK how about DeAngelo, Gropp and Holden for Shaw, Byron and a little retention?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fatfrancesa View Post
    Galchenyuk has way to many issues to invest in him right now. Having off ice problems make him a complete nonstarter for me. He's not good enough to carry that baggage and contract. If kreider is going how about turris on Ottawa as the base for a trade? No thanks on rnh in Edmonton. talk about soft. I don t think the guy can bench 75 lbs. I'm in no hurry to trade kreider in fact I'd rather move zucc. But if I'm trading either I'm not rushing into it to try and salvage this year. I will not get ripped off in the deal. They both have value and both carry fair contracts.
    I mean, don't we have enough bland, vanilla, nothing players? Give me something to watch. Give me Shaw AND Galchenyuk. Surely AV can't cut the balls off both players.
    FIRE VIGNEAULT

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phil in Absentia View Post
    http://nypost.com/2017/10/31/rangers...scouting-trip/

    I actually mentioned Shaw, by name, in my last C4C article. The five-year term sucks, but that's what retention is for. If MTL is willing to eat at least 25%, he'd be in at around $2.9M.
    I mentioned him in the Montreal thread. Hope I didn't start a rumor.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giacomin View Post
    I don't get you guys. Do you not understand that Mario Tremblay said on radio a few days ago that Galchenyuk had "twice sought help for substance abuse problems". Likely opioids. It sounded like something he was dealing with last year and this summer. A known Montreal beat reporter said that they've tried to trade him at a discount. Said he had a partyier rep. No takers. Both his coaches say he refuses to play defense and isn't a true center. His effort has been questioned multiple times.

    And you guys would consider trading Kreids for him. Why? Even if they throw in a pick. Geez, if we are gonna trade Kreids, let's not make it for guys teams are trying to dump. Galy is too risky. If Gorton does this I'll lose my shit. Take a flier on Galy with a prospect and conditional draft pick. That's my limit.

    For Kreids how about RNH and Nurse. Or if it is Ottawa, how about for Mark Stone (my UFA pick who'd have to agrees to a new 6 year 6 mil contract with us) to be our 1RW of the future. Or Josh Manson and a top forward prospect. Point is, Kreids should be a piece used when we can get prized value in return. If his value is not high enough now, then wait until it is. He should get hot eventually.
    Completely agree on the valuation part.

    Once again, however, I am not ready to part with Kreider. As frustrating as his short start to the season has been.

    Aside from what he brings to the table in terms of average goal output in a season, along with speed and setting screens, he’s one of our few tougher players on a team with a high milquetoast quotient. Patience is my preference for him. But if there are any pussies we can trade I’d look under that skirt first.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Respecttheblue View Post
    Completely agree on the valuation part.

    Once again, however, I am not ready to part with Kreider. As frustrating as his short start to the season has been.

    Aside from what he brings to the table in terms of average goal output in a season, along with speed and setting screens, he’s one of our few tougher players on a team with a high milquetoast quotient. Patience is my preference for him. But if there are any pussies we can trade I’d look under that skirt first.
    Even when Kreids is not bringing any skilled stick handling or good passing (aside from the pass to the point as he skates from behind the goal), at all, this year... he still adds valuably due to other useful attributes like his screens and his chase and his size and immense strength.

    He should go nowhere, unless we are offered a piece we can't refuse. Often, that only happens if one is not marketing said asset. It also helps if the player is hot versus a slump.

    There are some select players, attractive enough to target, where Kreider could be the key piece going the other way. I mentioned a couple in Anaheim. There are more than a couple in Winnipeg. Doubt those teams give up 1 of the guys I want. Duchesne could be a consideration, but Sakic would want much more, so I'm out. There is probably very few win-win deals out there.

    If a fan wants to scream TRADE Kreider, then we have the right to tune them out. Give us the specific trade (or at least the basis of it) or shut up.
    Last edited by Giacomin; 11-01-2017 at 02:29 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    Well if Kreider is getting traded I'm tearing it down. There are a shit load of if's but this is all wild speculation anyway.

    In my perfect world, 3 years from now, we have Zib 27 - Chyitl 21 - Andersson 21 down the middle, Miller 27 - Vesey 27 - Buch 25 on the wings, Skjei 26 on D, Igor 24 in net. Now add to that young core a 26 year old now mature Galchenyuk, our own high 1st rounder in 2018, a high 1st rounder from MTL in 2018, and mid to late 2018 1st rounder from trading Nash at the deadline. Add another first of our own in 2019. Maybe one more for trading Zucc. What could you add to it if you traded McD? If you're going Zib, Chyitl, Andersson down the middle there's no room for Hayes, what can he bring back?
    if management came out and stated that this is the plan today, i'm totally on board with it. understand you are perfect worlding it here but believe 1 or 2 of those 1st round gets is totally obtainable.

    give's me wood just thinking about it. long as we dont draft 4 mcilrath's.

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    Right, don't get me wrong, I want them (the team) to get their shit together, win and make the playoffs. However, if they don't I want them (managment) to admit defeat, bite the bullet and rebuild properly.

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    http://www.sportsnet.ca/?sn-article=...uge-impact-nhl

    The New York Rangers caused a huge stir Monday night when Glen Sather, Doug Risebrough, Jim Schoenfeld and Gilles Leger showed up in the Canadian capital for Montreal/Ottawa.
    The message was clear. The Rangers are ready to re-stock. Now comes the next question: How far will they go? My sense is they are honest about who they are. They’re not interested in the “dreaded middle.” In addition to Andersson and Chytil, they are excited about Russian goalie Igor Shesterkin, just named to that country’s Karjala Cup team. They want more. Picks and prospects, keep them coming.
    What really intrigues, though, is their roster. I don’t get the sense the Rangers are in any hurry, but they know what they have. The UFAs are obvious: Rick Nash. Michael Grabner. Nick Holden. That’s the simple play, very easy to do.
    I can’t see them moving a Pavel Buchnevich, a Brady Skjei or a Mika Zibanejad. But what I do see is the Rangers testing other possibilities. Not necessarily offering certain players, but checking their value. Name one contender who wouldn’t love a Ryan McDonagh or a Mats Zuccarello. (Both have one year remaining on their contracts.) Chris Kreider has two. J.T. Miller is a restricted free agent, but I could see contenders liking his versatility, since he can play everywhere up front.
    How much self-surgery do they want to do, and when do they want to do it? Several teams will be waiting for those answers.

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    This is all very exciting. Let's not beat around the bush here. This team has been dead for years. They've played soft, uninspired hockey since 2014. A win against a 4th string goalie (almost a loss) is not impressive. The team is not impressive. Mediocrity scares the shit out of me so if they're going to suck, I'm okay with it. Just please, for the love of god, let management have the wherewithal to understand what's happening here.

    "Rebuilding on the fly" isn't a thing. "Rebuilding on the fly" means finishing 7th-10th.

    (also please trade Kevin Hayes, thank you)
    FIRE VIGNEAULT

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    I'm interested to see what Gorton's philosophy is. He has yet to make this team truly his, but trading Step/Raanta for futures is a big start. The salary cap is a relatively recent factor. If you think about it, we haven't really had a GM (yet) that attempts to play the cap game the right way (sell of older assets for youth to keep a constant influx of young talent). We've only ever had the holdover of a bygone era in Glen Sather, who after finding some success quickly reverted to old habits of going "all-in" every deadline, thus creating the current mess.

    It would be great to see Gorton grab the bull by the horns and get on board with proper cap management. Retaining guys for $6 mil when you could trade them (anyone remember when we could've had Vatanen for Girardi?) is poor asset management, and adding even more salary at the deadline is even worse. Admit that the gamble didn't pay off, and start fixing it now. Otherwise we get what we've always gotten: protracted, successive decades of mediocrity due to a failure to actually commit to rebuilding.

    You don't need to tank to win, and draft picks aren't worthless crapshoots. All you have to do is keep giving yourself the next chance at finding a Pavel Buchnevich or Chris Kreider who you have for under $1 mil a season for the next three years.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThirtyONE View Post
    This is all very exciting. Let's not beat around the bush here. This team has been dead for years. They've played soft, uninspired hockey since 2014. A win against a 4th string goalie (almost a loss) is not impressive. The team is not impressive. Mediocrity scares the shit out of me so if they're going to suck, I'm okay with it. Just please, for the love of god, let management have the wherewithal to understand what's happening here.

    "Rebuilding on the fly" isn't a thing. "Rebuilding on the fly" means finishing 7th-10th.

    (also please trade Kevin Hayes, thank you)
    I could see Ray throwing a “ Hayes going away” party if that happened

    I’ll take that article with a grain of salt until I see some sort of indication management is serious about making real changes. Making a minor trade to bring in say a bottom six winger isn’t enough. There’s no need to reiterate what needs to be addressed. I’m just agreeing with your statement of them not rebuilding on the fly anymore. Do it right.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
    No chance. Kreider consistently goes to the dirty areas. Miller does sometimes. I feel other games he floats around too much.
    That's as much what they're asked to do as anything. Kreider's a lot more noticeable in front of the net, especially on the PP, because that's where he's asked to be.

    Kreider and Miller are both guilty of floating.

  20. #40
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    Miller has become like a points ninja. He goes from being noticeable to ghost yet keeps racking up points.

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