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Thread: The Case for Keeping Rick Nash

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    In the 5 seasons he's been here, Nash has only 1 great year, 2014-2015, where he played 79 games, and scored 42 goals.
    In his other seasons, he's never scored more then 26 goals in any season, and never played more then 67 games...in other words, he's never played a full season for us.
    The Ranger didn't make the trade for Nash nor pay his 7.8 million a year for this...and not for his defense. He's not worth the extension, and forget trading him, unless it's at the deadline, he's playing well & the Rangers are out of the playoff race.
    He's a 33 year old streak scorer & not worth another 3 years at any price. The team is better off looking to replace him through the 2018 free agency or getting a lucky trade.

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    Rick Nash didn't cause the lockout, when he paced 40+. He didn't deliver the cheap shot to his own head when he was pacing 40+.

    His first three years here he was worth every penny.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    Rick Nash didn't cause the lockout, when he paced 40+. He didn't deliver the cheap shot to his own head when he was pacing 40+.

    His first three years here he was worth every penny.
    If you're going to make excuses for him, and he's worth every penny the first 3 years, explain the two seasons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    If you're going to make excuses for him, and he's worth every penny the first 3 years, explain the two seasons.

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    He's human.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    If you're going to make excuses for him, and he's worth every penny the first 3 years, explain the two seasons.

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    What two seasons? The last two? I didn't say he's worth it the last two. And what excuses? You can't play 82 games during a lockout season. You can't play 82 games when you get concussed on a cheap elbow.

    The only thing I'm even debating is the ridiculous rhetoric around him that he'd be worth a jock strap in a trade, or that he's soft, or blah blah blah blah. He signed a long extension with another team when he was a 40 goal scorer, and he played as a 40 goal guy here for 3 seasons. Would you sign him to that contract today, no, but that's how it goes when guys turn 32, and it's the contracts that every team in the league has. So the whining about Rick Nash's contract is annoying, and saying "he's not worth it at any price" is beyond silly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SaveByRichter35 View Post
    He's human.
    Yes, he is....and he's not worth tying up millions of more dollars over another 3 or 4 years of salary cap. He's not going to get any better as he gets older.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    Yes, he is....and he's not worth tying up millions of more dollars over another 3 or 4 years of salary cap. He's not going to get any better as he gets older.

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    No one is saying he will be so what exactly are you arguing?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    What two seasons? The last two? I didn't say he's worth it the last two. And what excuses? You can't play 82 games during a lockout season. You can't play 82 games when you get concussed on a cheap elbow.

    The only thing I'm even debating is the ridiculous rhetoric around him that he'd be worth a jock strap in a trade, or that he's soft, or blah blah blah blah. He signed a long extension with another team when he was a 40 goal scorer, and he played as a 40 goal guy here for 3 seasons. Would you sign him to that contract today, no, but that's how it goes when guys turn 32, and it's the contracts that every team in the league has. So the whining about Rick Nash's contract is annoying, and saying "he's not worth it at any price" is beyond silly.
    Pacing 40 goals is not scoring 40 goals. Doesn't matter if there was a lockout or he was injured. You can only count what he puts in the net.
    You brought up how good he was the 1st 3 years, what pointed out is that he hasn't been worth 7.8 M year the last 2 seasons. Too many times the phrase "Nash hasnt scored" in x amount of games has been used during his time in NYC by the press & broadcaster. He's not consistent.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    Yes, he is....and he's not worth tying up millions of more dollars over another 3 or 4 years of salary cap. He's not going to get any better as he gets older.

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    No one is looking for him to get better. That's the original argument of the thread. "The case for keeping Rick Nash". Forget the $7.8m. Forget 40 goal seasons. If we can resign Nash, a veteran 20 goal scorer that plays in all situations for $3-4 million per for 3 years, that's a steal. Look at what Marleau and Thornton just signed for.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SaveByRichter35 View Post
    No one is saying he will be so what exactly are you arguing?
    Very simple... that giving Nash an extension at say 3 or 4 years at say 4M a year when he's not scoring is not worth it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    Pacing 40 goals is not scoring 40 goals. Doesn't matter if there was a lockout or he was injured. You can only count what he puts in the net.
    You brought up how good he was the 1st 3 years, what pointed out is that he hasn't been worth 7.8 M year the last 2 seasons. Too many times the phrase "Nash hasnt scored" in x amount of games has been used during his time in NYC by the press & broadcaster. He's not consistent.

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    So when GM's and agents are negotiating you think the GM says "Well you only scored 21 goals during the lockout, so that's gonna lower your price." and the agent responds "Yeah, you're right, my guy sucked that year."?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    Very simple... that giving Nash an extension at say 3 or 4 years at say 4M a year when he's not scoring is not worth it.

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    He is scoring! How many 20 goal scorers were there last year, and (excluding guys on ELC's) what was their average salary?
    Last edited by Long live the King; 08-31-2017 at 03:14 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    Very simple... that giving Nash an extension at say 3 or 4 years at say 4M a year when he's not scoring is not worth it.

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    How many 20-goal scorers who excel in every situation make less than $4m that aren't on an ELC?

    It's basically Rick Nash and Paul Byron, who signed after being a nothing player his entire career.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    No one is looking for him to get better. That's the original argument of the thread. "The case for keeping Rick Nash". Forget the $7.8m. Forget 40 goal seasons. If we can resign Nash, a veteran 20 goal scorer that plays in all situations for $3-4 million per for 3 years, that's a steal. Look at what Marleau and Thornton just signed for.
    And if they don't produce, Toronto & San Jose are stuck with them. If they don't produce, and their teams buy them out since they are over 35 or they retire during the length their contracts, all of that money stays on their books until the contracts expires.
    Your argument is that is that it's better to keep Nash for 4M a year as a 20+ goal scorer for 3 or 4 year. I think it's better to find a younger player in free agency or a trade, or see if there is a player like Chytil who develops & has an upside, then to keep Nash around.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    Pacing 40 goals is not scoring 40 goals. Doesn't matter if there was a lockout or he was injured. You can only count what he puts in the net.
    You brought up how good he was the 1st 3 years, what pointed out is that he hasn't been worth 7.8 M year the last 2 seasons. Too many times the phrase "Nash hasnt scored" in x amount of games has been used during his time in NYC by the press & broadcaster. He's not consistent.

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    And this is where I bow out of any further conversation with you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    So when GM's and agents are negotiating you think the GM says "Well you only scored 21 goals during the lockout, so that's gonna lower your price." and the agent responds "Yeah, you're right, my guy sucked that year."?
    No...you don't get paid for what you didn't score. You can't say he would have scored 40+ if they played all 82 games that season, because you don't know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    No...you don't get paid for what you didn't score. You can't say he would have scored 40+ if they played all 82 games that season, because you don't know.

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    Yea, Patrik Elias, Nathan Horton and Tuuka Rask all came at a major discount after the lockout-shortened season.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slats6NYR View Post
    And if they don't produce, Toronto & San Jose are stuck with them. If they don't produce, and their teams buy them out since they are over 35 or they retire during the length their contracts, all of that money stays on their books until the contracts expires.
    Your argument is that is that it's better to keep Nash for 4M a year as a 20+ goal scorer for 3 or 4 year. I think it's better to find a younger player in free agency or a trade, or see if there is a player like Chytil who develops & has an upside, then to keep Nash around.

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    Where are these young unsigned 20 goal scorers? They don't exist. Trading for one is expensive. Chytil is 17 years old, signing Nash to a 3 year extension has no effect on a kid who will still be on his ELC throughout the extension.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    Where are these young unsigned 20 goal scorers? They don't exist. Trading for one is expensive. Chytil is 17 years old, signing Nash to a 3 year extension has no effect on a kid who will still be on his ELC throughout the extension.
    This is really the crux of all the "trade Nash for nothing" talk.

    Wanting to dump him is easy but nobody has realistic plans for how to replace him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Future View Post
    This is really the crux of all the "trade Nash for nothing" talk.

    Wanting to dump him is easy but nobody has realistic plans for how to replace him.
    Which is why half of me thinks replacing 7.8M defensively sound 20-30 goal scorer Rick Nash with 3-4M defensively sound 20 goal scorer Rick Nash sounds like a good idea.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Long live the King View Post
    Where are these young unsigned 20 goal scorers? They don't exist. Trading for one is expensive. Chytil is 17 years old, signing Nash to a 3 year extension has no effect on a kid who will still be on his ELC throughout the extension.
    If the Rangers don't sign Nash after the season ends, that frees up 7.8 million in cap space for 2018-19. We don't know where the cap will be next season. Since the Rangers are always close to the ceiling, not giving Nash an extension would give them a lot of room to work with. There's got to be at least one player who will be available in free agency, who can:

    A)score at least 20+ goals
    B) who is a few years younger then Nash
    C) want to play in New York
    who that money can go to.

    Trades are tough. Making good ones are tougher. But I'd rather wait & see if a trade can be made, then to tie up another 4M a year in Nash.
    We have some tradable assets in extra defensemen (Holden, D'Angelo), some young prospects on the blue line (Day, Graves, Pionik, Bereglazov), can package someone with Hayes or Grabner or picks. It won't get at top player, but should get someone who can score 20+ goals. If Nash is signed, the team has less cap space to make a trade.

    If Nash is re-signed for whatever amount & term it effects the entire salary cap & roster. Over the course of term of a Nash contract, players have ELC's will expire (Vesey, Bushneivich, Skjei & D'Angelo), all need to be re-signed with a raise.

    If they aren't traded, Miller, Hayes & Grabner's contracts expire that the end of this season. Zuccarello's end in 2019. All of them will need raises too if they re-sign. If the Rangers sign Nash, do they​ not sign one or two of them later on because they don't have the space?

    Just re-signing Nash take a roster spot. If Chytil or anyone else in the system is ready to make the jump over the next couple of years, and Nash is on the roster, then another forward will need to be moved.

    This is all speculation. Over the course of the next few years none of us know what moves will be made

    The team has a big enough hole to fill at Center losing both Stephan & Lindberg. Unless Gorton pulls something out of his ass the next few weeks, they're going with what they have in house and won't fix it until next season.

    As a fan, I'd rather see them not sign Nash.



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