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Thread: Should the Rangers Move Stepan in the Offseason?

  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drew a Penalty View Post
    If you're expecting Stepan, or really most players to produce like Malkin then you're expecting too much. Most teams would love a player like Malkin. Pittsburgh has two in him and Crosby.

    As inconsistent as Stepan may be, he's productive. Among all centers, in the last four years, he's 20th in points. It's not like he isn't for the most part doing his job. He's a top line center, more of a good number two like Kesler, but his production isn't the issue that you make it out to be. I'd love for the Rangers to have a more dynamic center, which Stepan is not, but you don't blame the losses on him. You can look at this season for him and see it's clearly not the norm. He's pacing below his usual output even for someone as streaky.

    I'd move Stepan if it means helping in another area such as acquiring better defenseman, but not because he's failed in his position. No one short of an elite talent is enough to push the team over the hump if you're just looking to upgrade at center. Defense is far more glaring of an issue.

    I also don't really see anyone calling Stepan a bargain contract. Future mistakenly thought he was paid $5.5M as opposed to $6.5M which if that were the case that would be a bargain.

    Well that's the point. Stepan is and has been the team's top/ 1st line center by default. He's not the problem for his play. He IS a problem because of his production in his role. Im not expecting him to put up those kind of points.

    He does what he does, plays a decent all around game as a set up man, but maybe the problem is using him as a top player instead of a 2nd or 3rd liner? The guy gets PP time and doesn't really do much when he's out there on it. A better player in his spot would maybe be better option.

    Stepan the player is good. Stepan as one of the team's TOP players is the problem.

    I am suggesting getting an elite talent at center or even at forward, no matter how old they are or how long their contract is for, in return for Stepan.

    I've been told by some here over the years that his contract is good. Maybe bargain is me stretching it a little to get my point across. Sorry.
    Last edited by The Dude; 03-11-2017 at 10:49 AM.

  2. #122
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    If you're tying production to cost, fine, but then don't say that the argument doesn't include his production when it clearly does. Production is always a factor. Stepan's production was a factor in him getting his contract and it's a factor in deciding whether or not he still lives up to it. You're saying you'd have preferred him to be underpaid. Me too, but he's not. We could have had him at McDonagh's term and hit, but we don't. Now we've got him at more of a market value. It's the price you pay. With the exception of this season, a down year, he's produced in ways that live up to his contract.

    You move Stepan in a deal that helps the team the most. Trading for a player like Justin Faulk would be a good move. It addresses an issue of defense and leads to cap savings for a few seasons. You don't expect that you can make a Brassard for Zibanejad deal every time because it's impractical. Not every team is willing to make that trade and you pose a risk making it. Brassard for Zibanejad gave the team moderate short-term savings. If you're constantly working on these short-term deals then you're in a constant re-tool and you can't win that way. Maybe the Blackhawks can, but they don't retool around atrocious contracts on bad players.

    There's also too much fear when it comes to the words NMC or NTC. It just allows a player to decide where they're going. It doesn't mean that they're immovable. Nash and Girardi will both have modified clauses come July 1 should they both still be on the team. Only Staal and Lundqvist will still have NMCs. Staal, Nash, and Girardi are the players you look to sacrifice to make changes. Guys who haven't played up to par. It's more difficult, but the rationale is there.

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    Well that's the point. Stepan is and has been the team's top/ 1st line center by default. He's not the problem for his play. He IS a problem because of his production in his role. Im not expecting him to put up those kind of points.

    He does what he does, plays a decent all around game as a set up man, but maybe the problem is using him as a top player instead of a 2nd or 3rd liner? The guy gets PP time and doesn't really do much when he's out there on it. A better player in his spot would maybe be better option.

    Stepan the player is good. Stepan as one of the team's TOP players is the problem.

    I am suggesting getting an elite talent at center or even at forward, no matter how old they are or how long their contract is for, in return for Stepan.

    I've been told by some here over the years that his contract is good. Maybe bargain is me stretching it a little to get my point across. Sorry.
    His contract is alright. I just don't know if I've ever seen anyone call it good. It's fair given his ask and any comparable contracts.

    I get what you're suggesting and I think the likelihood of it happening is slim. Stepan for Duchene, for instance, is a move that doesn't put you over the top. Duchene is more talented than Stepan, but the difference in play isn't enough to put the team over the top when other pieces aren't functioning properly.

    Anything short of an actual game changing talent won't make a difference. Those game changers aren't easy to come by and are not available. At least not at a price the Rangers can remotely pay without sacrificing everything.

    Stepan for Thornton doesn't help the team. Maybe a few years ago, but the risk in the deal is so huge. It's another Marty St. Louis deal. Thornton isn't going to be dynamic enough to make the difference. Maybe a glimpse here or there, but he's going to be 38 and his production is already fluctuating. We got St. Louis while he was producing at a point per game and then his production fell of a cliff. The same could happen to Thornton. It just isn't worth it.

  4. #124
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    Derek Stepan is watching:


  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by LONG TIME FAN View Post
    Derek Stepan is watching:

    Tell him to get in line. That's the story of my life.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drew a Penalty View Post
    His contract is alright. I just don't know if I've ever seen anyone call it good. It's fair given his ask and any comparable contracts.

    I get what you're suggesting and I think the likelihood of it happening is slim. Stepan for Duchene, for instance, is a move that doesn't put you over the top. Duchene is more talented than Stepan, but the difference in play isn't enough to put the team over the top when other pieces aren't functioning properly.

    Anything short of an actual game changing talent won't make a difference. Those game changers aren't easy to come by and are not available. At least not at a price the Rangers can remotely pay without sacrificing everything.

    Stepan for Thornton doesn't help the team. Maybe a few years ago, but the risk in the deal is so huge. It's another Marty St. Louis deal. Thornton isn't going to be dynamic enough to make the difference. Maybe a glimpse here or there, but he's going to be 38 and his production is already fluctuating. We got St. Louis while he was producing at a point per game and then his production fell of a cliff. The same could happen to Thornton. It just isn't worth it.
    Thornton is an arbitrary name I'm throwing out there. Though I disagree about how dynamic he still is..

    Point is, getting something for that contract for the now. I can't think of a player getting up there in age that is still a difference maker that would be a good move. Im sure there's a few. Heck, like others have said, maybe trade him for a defenseman.

    Overall point was, relying on a good player like Stepan, with a cast of similar talent level players, isn't going to win any cups. I guess that's why they brought in Nash. That hasn't worked out. Yet, it seems like the team has turned Nash into a guy that fits the mold Stepan is cut out from. He's gone from top tier scoring talent, to .... a good PK guy that can pop in 20 goals.. Maybe there is no fixing this team. Maybe this is what the coaching staff wants them to be. Pass happy, passive, weak, slow paced, non risk taking, low energy, middle of the road hockey.

    Duchene IMO, could be a game changer though. I have a feeling he winds up an Islander or Devil though.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Dude View Post
    Thornton is an arbitrary name I'm throwing out there. Though I disagree about how dynamic he still is..

    Point is, getting something for that contract for the now. I can't think of a player getting up there in age that is still a difference maker that would be a good move. Im sure there's a few. Heck, like others have said, maybe trade him for a defenseman.

    Overall point was, relying on a good player like Stepan, with a cast of similar talent level players, isn't going to win any cups. I guess that's why they brought in Nash. That hasn't worked out. Yet, it seems like the team has turned Nash into a guy that fits the mold Stepan is cut out from. He's gone from top tier scoring talent, to .... a good PK guy that can pop in 20 goals.. Maybe there is no fixing this team. Maybe this is what the coaching staff wants them to be. Pass happy, passive, weak, slow paced, non risk taking, low energy, middle of the road hockey.

    Duchene IMO, could be a game changer though. I have a feeling he winds up an Islander or Devil though.
    I could restate my point about anything short of a real elite talent being enough to acutally make a difference in that spot, but I've done that twice already so I don't think it'll be acknowledged much at all. Instead I'll just say that the Rangers are tied for second in goals scored right now. How much further up can one conceivably go?

    I think in any move with Stepan the only move you should be making is fixing the backend. Anything else is lateral save for an ELITE talent. Not someone who can pace 60 points similarly. Over a point per game consistently.

  8. #128
    Junior Member Ranger11's Avatar
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    That's a good point. I don't know what Zib is gonna ask for but the only big savings was this year and when you look at the time he missed and what he actdid for us I don't really think it was that spectacular. I understand the reasons for the trade but I think a lot of fans are forgetting how good Brass was for us and how good Zucc was on his line. Look at Zucc's numbers this year now.

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